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Before Archiving the total rating was: 
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REM
Team Manager
Australia
9319 Posts
joined 27 Sep 03
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shr
Team Manager
Australia
2510 Posts
joined 02 Feb 07
offline |
 Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 09:57:43
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hmmm... the boys ay djr/jbr seem to not have issues with this. i knew from the get go that the ford teams were going to have these sort of problems. huge difference with the front splitters on the "ve" & "bf".
& before the holden boys come out & say TK had brake issues, he had a leak (major) not over temp problems.
just have to wait & see what happens. |
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REM
Team Manager
Australia
9319 Posts
joined 27 Sep 03
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 10:01:40
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| Are you aware if their(DJR) brake temperatures were higher or not? They may have run a lot hotter...... but not failed.......this time? |
Season 2012 Factory team battle: FPR: 14 race wins; HRT:0 race wins
2013(CoTF) is the "year of the VF Party" Garth Tander Symmons Plains
RIP ERM 31/3/2008.....Godspeed Big fella
www.Getup.org.au
The carbon tax will bring about the end of the world! |
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shr
Team Manager
Australia
2510 Posts
joined 02 Feb 07
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 10:11:21
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| i did say seem to not have issues. but i guess if most of the ford teams are having problems it's fair to say that DJR probally would be to. maybe they just handle it better. |
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R2J2G
Team Manager
Australia
1774 Posts
joined 24 Nov 06
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Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 10:52:09
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| if this is true, tega should move quickly to rectify it and get a new front bar, and open up the brake ducts, becuase thats a big safety issue.. |
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donkman
I'm your Passenger
Australia
5192 Posts
joined 11 Feb 04
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 11:06:11
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| I sure hope that they fix this asap, so it cannot be used as an excuse at the end of the year! |
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HOLDEN 1
Holden No1
Australia
2429 Posts
joined 15 May 06
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 11:20:41
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quote:
Originally posted by REM
Todays MN confirms that there is a problem with the new BF areo pg. 4.....that relates to brakes. Apparently the new brake package is running approx. 200deg. hotter than last year on leading Ford teams.
the issue centres around the ducts are in a different place to BA(one supposes due the air dam being shorter) and are 'HALF' the size of those on the VE. Ford teams are pushing for a hybrid of the BA front spoiler to be tested.
looks like another adavantge to the Holdens boys....no brake issues of this sort have been reported by any Holden teams to date!
It appears that driver safety may be being compromised in the BF...as per JC's high speed brake issues......with the brakes just going in an instant.
geting hard to see the good guys coming back from here this year, aint it?
I guess such issues are beyond the limitations of the TEGA straight line aero testing!
Mate for a start it's NOT Holden's problem that the BF does have brake issues they should had it sorted out BEFORE the start of the season.
and you cant tell me they have just picked this up. |
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REM
Team Manager
Australia
9319 Posts
joined 27 Sep 03
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 11:22:07
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Afraid that it may already be the case`Donkman...as Jc's appeared to Fords best hope this year...and has had his season derailed by this very issue at WA. TWR will simply build on their points base from here...almost game over.......it seems?
Edit:
Ah HOLDEN 1...an insightful, objective analysis.....as always! How exactly would the Ford teams know before the 'start' of the season that in race conditions they would have brake issues? Also before this year...a limited number of teams ran that brake package. And finally were either the BF or the VE tested last year with the control brake package? Holden have not manufactured this situation...but that have lucked in big time...and their massive brake ducts appear to give thema significant adavantge....deal with it! However as it is a safety issue and a parity formula...something must be done to make the cars equal! |
Season 2012 Factory team battle: FPR: 14 race wins; HRT:0 race wins
2013(CoTF) is the "year of the VF Party" Garth Tander Symmons Plains
RIP ERM 31/3/2008.....Godspeed Big fella
www.Getup.org.au
The carbon tax will bring about the end of the world! |
Edited by - REM on 04 Apr 2007 11:29:31 |
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HOLDEN 1
Holden No1
Australia
2429 Posts
joined 15 May 06
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 11:35:41
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quote:
Originally posted by REM
Afraid that it may already be the case`Donkman...as Jc's appeared to Fords best hope this year...and has had his season derailed by this very issue at WA. TWR will simply build on their points base from here...almost game over.......it seems?
Edit:
Ah HOLDEN 1...an insightful, objective analysis.....as always! How exactly would the Ford teams know before the 'start' of the season that in race conditions they would have brake issues? Also before this year...a limited number of teams ran that brake package. And finally were either the BF or the VE tested last year with the control brake package? Holden have not manufactured this situation...but that have lucked in big time...and their massive brake ducts appear to give thema significant adavantge....deal with it! However as it is a safety issue and a parity formula...something must be done to make the cars equal!
rem as i believe that the cars should be equal (and need to make them equal) i cant some how think that it is Holden's fault or have luck or what ever the case maybe. Howlong did it take the Holden teams to adjust to the wishbone front end all those years while ford had a good run? |
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supercar_freek
Team Manager
New Zealand
2498 Posts
joined 27 Feb 06
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 11:38:07
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Why was this issue not raise during the teams pre season testing? They all have data that show this temperature and all the teams did test before the opening round! You cannot tell me that they would not have looked that this data when testing and also noticed a significant difference in braking abilities.
To wait until now to make a statement is just PR BS.
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shiftyeyes_07
Team Manager
Australia
1734 Posts
joined 15 Feb 07
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 11:41:20
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that wasnt an 'issue' it didnt cause a saftey hazzard like the brake thing with the BF.
i sure hope they sort this out rather quickly, but knowing VESA/TEGA
it may be awhile..
quote:
Why was this issue not raise during the teams pre season testing? They all have data that show this temperature and all the teams did test before the opening round! You cannot tell me that they would not have looked that this data when testing and also noticed a significant difference in braking abilities.
To wait until now to make a statement is just PR BS.
maybe because the track that most teams test at QR doesnt have HUGE braking areas, therefore the temps wouldnt get high, but take this to a circuit that has heavy braking (IE Perth or even Puke) and the problem would become more evident |
Edited by - shiftyeyes_07 on 04 Apr 2007 11:43:13 |
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REM
Team Manager
Australia
9319 Posts
joined 27 Sep 03
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 11:44:07
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Running around at Qld or whereever with you team mate is very different to being be stuck on track with 30 other cars..these conditions are not replicable in testing really are they? Re the wishbone front end, that was done to make the cars equal, give the BF the same size brake ducts now and they will be 'equal' if it then takes them six montsh or whatever to sort it out...well so what!
The fact that this a safety issue really puts the onus on TEGA to act now...
It was always on the cards that new models would need alighnment, not sure why the Holden boys are getting so testy, surley they want 'fair and safe' competition? |
Season 2012 Factory team battle: FPR: 14 race wins; HRT:0 race wins
2013(CoTF) is the "year of the VF Party" Garth Tander Symmons Plains
RIP ERM 31/3/2008.....Godspeed Big fella
www.Getup.org.au
The carbon tax will bring about the end of the world! |
Edited by - REM on 04 Apr 2007 11:45:56 |
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shr
Team Manager
Australia
2510 Posts
joined 02 Feb 07
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 11:49:07
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so now we have holden fans jumping up & down about an issue that has come about to do with a brake duct issue that ford have developed through race conditions.
teams do not test at every race circuit in the country in pre-season testing. & it is also clear that the holden teams front splitter has far greater brake ducts than that of the ford. yet i guess some holden fans don't mind seeing a ford screaming off into the wall due to brake failure hey.
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supercar_freek
Team Manager
New Zealand
2498 Posts
joined 27 Feb 06
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 12:00:24
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quote:
Originally posted by REM
not sure why the Holden boys are getting so testy, surley they want 'fair and safe' competition?
For a start this is a discussion and If you don't want an apposing view then do not post. I have not seen any "Testy" holden boys that you make reference to.
quote:
Originally posted by REM
Running around at Qld or whereever with you team mate is very different to being be stuck on track with 30 other cars..these conditions are not replicable in testing really are they?
What is the purpose of testing then if it is just about running around with your team mate in different conditions to racing? Testing is all about emulating race conditions.
The fact is whether you have a track with hard braking or not, the teams would be able to see in the first 5 minutes that the data on brake temperature is higher than during previous testing of the older car. Yes you may not see an issue arise until you hit the hard braking tracks but it is obvious is you had higher temps in testing by x% then that is going to be even worse on a hard braking track.
Are you saying that the Ford boys are not clever enough to work that out?
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Edited by - supercar_freek on 04 Apr 2007 12:03:08 |
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HOLDEN 1
Holden No1
Australia
2429 Posts
joined 15 May 06
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 12:15:38
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If it is a safty issue and i am sure it is, then why shift the blame on Holden and it's fans. It seems as always in most cases that
fordie fans blame Holden when in fact it's up to ford and the teams to MAKE sure their cars are fit for competition? |
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jamolad
Premenstrual Icelandic Wombat
Australia
1168 Posts
joined 08 Dec 06
offline |
Posted - 04 Apr 2007 : 12:17:06
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| Will be interesting if not sorted by NZ - aren't they on the limiter in 6th (albeit with a shorter diff) before braking for one of the slowest hairpins around (other than Simmons Plains) |
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